ТРОЈА, вистина или еп?

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Pa, spored geolozite (ne nasi ili grcki), vo vremeto na Irodot, Pela se naogala na MORE.

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Interesno, a?
Mislam deka e toa zamasna povrsina.
Podocna, moreto se povleklo (stoznam, zemjotresi, tektoniki) i Pela ostanala na suvo.
Pa,zatoa iskopale kanal za voena flota (normalno i za trgovija).

Znaejki ja goleminata na brodovite od toa vreme,sepak moze da se zakluci, deka se sinale od kopanje.

Inaku, Pela,Voden, Berea, se naogjaat pomegu mnogu voda.
Vprocem,oblasta se narekuva i LAKE(I)...
Lake e zbor za zemja pokraj voda, se koristi i denes, bavcite za piper, lubenici (nivite) pokraj Vardar od Veles pa nadolu.

Vo angliskiot "Lake" e ezero...
 
Ова ќе го пикнам овде, бидејки во подтемата за Словените во британија никој не чита. Сепак и со ова е поврзано.

Јасно ни е на сите дека Келтите биле сојузници на Македонците. Па да видиме дали преку нив имаме некакви докази за нас. Во светот кружат податоци дека од историјата незадоволни се Келтите и Словените. Па еве на наша среќа отпочнува процес на барање на врските.

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Direct Object Double Marking in Celtic and South Slavic Languages
Preliminary Remarks ……………………………………….……………….….119
Elena Parina

Dr Elena Parina examines pronoun reprise in Celtic (Middle and Modern Welsh, Middle Irish) and Southern Slavic languages (Bulgarian and Macedonian)

http://www.celto-slavica.celtologica.com/index.htm

The Third International Colloquium of the Learned Society Societas Celto-Slavica

Celts and Slavs in Central and Southeastern Europe
18-19 September 2008
Dubrovnik, Croatia



Сега да прејдам на некои нитерсни податоци. Англичаните викаат дека во Илиада се запишани келтските митови. Сега еве гледаме дека тие се слични со Словенските, а некој ги препишал и присвоил.

Артефактите и симболите се прилично слични. Впрочем не за џабе и биле сојузници. Никој не вели дека се еден ист народ, туку имаат близок корен.

Veteris (commonly spelled Vitiris, Vheteris, Huetiris, and Hueteris) was a Celtic god attested from many inscriptions in Roman Britain.
Veteris may possibly be related to the Proto-Celtic root *weto- meaning 'air'

За ВЕТЕР не треба повеќе да се објаснува.

The Celtic god of light and healing, "Bel" means shining one, can be compared with the continental Apollo
Belenus is the Gaulish/Celtic god of light, and referred to as 'The Shining One'. His cult spread from northern Italy to southern Gaul and Britain.

In Irish Gaelic, the name "bile" translates to "sacred tree." Наша Билјана - БИЛКА (билката е дрво).

Зошто Македонците викаат БРАН и од каде, покрај ТАЛАС, ДАЛГА

On their journey, Bran encountered his half-brother, Manawyddan, God of the Sea, and eventually reached the land of Women. Here the goddess greeted him and they spent a whole year together happy and fulfilled. Eventually though, some of Bran's men wished to return home, but the goddess warned them that if they were to step foot on the British Isles, they would crumble to dust for, in reality, many centuries had passed since they had left home. Bran, however, ignored her warning and returned home. On reaching the shore, however, the first man to step ashore found the goddess' warning to be true, and his fellow mariners were forced to sail the seas for evermore.

Значи оној кој е проколнат да плови по морето засекогаш, БРАН.

Llŷr is a figure in Welsh mythology, the father of Bran
Llŷr corresponds to Lir in Irish mythology, and, like the latter, he is identified as a god of the sea.

ЛИР е богот на морето а БРАН е неговиот син (што е и логично)

Има уште личности и сличности, ќе ги постирам.
 
pa,spored geolozite (ne nasi ili grcki),vo vremeto na Irodot,Pela se naogala na MORE.

Значи може да се очекува пред 2000 П.Н.Е. да биле и големи површини од Пелагонија под вода, па и Вардарска долина до Стенае.

Што е тогаш со археолошките локалитети кои се стари по 6000 години, не е можно да се под вода, или тие се некако распоредени да се над водата. (ќе треба да ги видам арх. карти)
 
he..he..anglicanite..davam kralstvo za konj..
nie..nedavam kralstvo za putka...
interesno..nikoj ne ja spomna Elena...

Elena otisla vo Ilion..
ne po vrat,tuku po sija...
Elena e Ilija kazano za zensko...
Elena=Ilina...

inaku,smesno e da se slusaat/citaat objasnuvanjata na zborovite od Ilijadata od belosvetskite pan-helenisticki kvazi-istoricari...
primer e i forumov..
kolkumina samo se zaletaa po zborot anaveno,neznaejki mu go Belomorskato (Homerovoto) znacenje....

prmer 2..zborot gen..
za site e grcki...
no,vo grckiot etimoloski recnik na Andreoti (samo toj go imaat) stoi:
gen=arhaicen (negrcki,nepoznat)

koga samo ke se setam na Pelasgians...
 
zavisi poveketo lokaliteti se na visocinki pa taka da ima sansa za nekakva teorija no ako bilo se pod voda ke se najdese po nekoj ostatok od morski zivotni taka da ako se pronajdi vakov ostatok ovaa teorija e vozmozna mada ne me ubeduva
 
Значи може да се очекува пред 2000 П.Н.Е. да биле и големи површини од Пелагонија под вода, па и Вардарска долина до Стенае.

Што е тогаш со археолошките локалитети кои се стари по 6000 години, не е можно да се под вода, или тие се некако распоредени да се над водата. (ќе треба да ги видам арх. карти)

Dzabe ke gledas, toa e istrazeno od nasite i amerikancite od poodamna.
Ima studija za toa od geo zdruzenieto na SAD.
Samo Belomorskiot teren okolu Pela bil pod voda.

Otide "daleku" so tie 6.000 god.
A nakolni "vrie" vo Skopska blatija, Prespa-Ohrid, Kostur-Krupista, Dojran, ama toa e drugo...
 
Абе морски остатоци има и на 1000 метра висина низ Македонија, да не претерам до 2000.

Ама тоа е небитно, бидејки се работи за периоди од милиони години.

Треба да се фокусираме на последните 10.000 години.
 
samo Belomorskiot teren okolu Pela bil pod voda...

ОК, тоа е тоа.

Значи тоа за Цвијич е сепак она што спомнав, НЕОГЕН 25 милиони години.
 
ОК, тоа е тоа.

Значи тоа за Цвијич е сепак она што спомнав, НЕОГЕН 25 милиони години.

Ma kakov Cvijik, moderno bre, sondi, busotini, cuda, vragovi.

Ne e tolku poodamna toa "poodamna", ima i moderni kartografski prikazi.

A toj neogen ... odi ponazad vo 65 mil god. i ke vidis deka MAKEDONIJA ne bila vo sostav na EU, tuku ostrov koj se otcepil od prvobitniot pra drn, drn...

Dokaz za toa e i ALSAR...
 
Јасно ни е на сите дека Келтите биле сојузници на Македонците. Па да видиме дали преку нив имаме некакви докази за нас.
Во светот кружат податоци дека од историјата незадоволни се Келтите и Словените.
Па еве на наша среќа отпочнува процес на барање на врските.

Koj kako. Ovoj vaka:

Clash of cultures
Archaeology and genetics

Mark Pluciennik
University of Leicester, UK
M.Pluciennik@le.ac.uk

ABSTRACT – This paper examines the ways in which genetic data have been used to interpret the transition to agriculture in Europe over the past two decades, and the relationship of these interpretations to more strictly archaeological explanations. It is suggested that, until recently, those working within the two disciplines have been using not only different data sets and methodologies, but also working within different disciplinary traditions which have inhibited communication and collaboration, and the production of a genuinely integrated field of ‘archaeogenetics’.
 
The Iron Age Background to the Formation of the Phrygian State

gi spomnav Brigite i selenjeto vo Turcija (nakaj Ilion?)..
OSCAR WHITE MUSCARELLA
The Metropolitan Museum of Art
1000 Fifth Avenue
New York, NY 10028

Recent excavations at Gordion have revealed below the destroyed Phrygian city (ca. 700 B.C.) an early Iron Age settlement with handmade coarse ware, which is followed by a settlement that contains the earliest Phrygian pottery forms.
The handmade ware relates to that from Troy and the Balkans and is considered firm evidence of the historically recorded migration of the Brygians into Anatolia.
A suggested chronology for the two early settlements is posited, based primarily on information from Troy.

Destructions of the Mycenaean centers occurred about the same time--and may have resulted from some of the same causes. In both regions thereafter writing ceased to exist until the eighth century B.C., giving rise to the alternative term "Dark Age" for the period (e.g., Ak*rgal 1983; Muscarella 1988 : 417)....

The identity of the forces that destroyed the Hittite polity still remains unknown (DALI E TAKA?)--although a number of candidates, e.g., the Sea Peoples (specifically named as the destroyers by Rameses III), Muski, Kashka, or alliances of these powers have been tendered and supported by various scholars....

Questia Media America, Inc.

www.questia.com
 
Se si ima i pocetok, pa taka:

Dardan

SYLLABICATION: Dar·dan
PRONUNCIATION: dдrdn
VARIANT FORMS: or Dar·da·ni·an (dдr-dn-n)
NOUN: Archaic A Trojan.
ETYMOLOGY: After Dardanus, the mythical founder of Troy.
OTHER FORMS: Dardan —ADJECTIVE


Odovde natamu:

Dardanelles

SYLLABICATION: Dar·da·nelles
PRONUNCIATION: dдrdn-lz
VARIANTS: Formerly Hel·les·pont (hl-spnt) (TRUBA OBJASNUVANJETO)
A strait connecting the Aegean Sea with the Sea of Marmara. In ancient times it was the scene of the legendary exploits of Hero and Leander.
 
TROY VI(1800-1275 B.C.)

As the Hittites were settling in Central Anatolia, another Indo-European people were flourishing in Canakkale, northwest region of Turkey at Troy VI, which today is one of Turkey's finest ruins, with a city wall preserved to a height of 4 meters, and a number of preserved megaron type ( a building type widely used during Bronze Age) houses.

Trojans are thought to be relatives of Mykens from Crete. Their settlement was mentioned in Iliad, Homer's epic, as the city of Ilion.

The city was abandoned and lost its importance after Balkan people proceeded to occupy Anatolia.
A major earthquake devastated the city in 1200 B.C.

P.S. Professor Eugene Borza:

"The theory of Dorian invasions is largely an invention of 19th century
historiography, and is otherwise unsupported by either archaeological
or linguistic evidence. Most archaeologists and many linguists have aba-
ndoned the belief that Greek speaking Dorians devastated Mycenaean
centers at the end of the Bronze Age..."
 
The date of this war, around 1180 B.C., was determined by such scientific methods as radiocarbon analysis and pottery seriation. This date corresponds with ancient Roman and Egyptian sources that date Homer’s Trojan War one year before the destruction of the Phoenician city of Sidon—which occurred, according to the latest research, shortly before 1180/1179 B.C....

The war did not mean the end of Troy, or the expulsion of the old population. But the city was now ruled by another people, whose pottery was less artistic than that of the previous occupants. Less than 50 years later, new immigrants again arrived, this time from the Balkans. They quickly adopted certain techniques from the native Trojans (for example, the use of the pottery wheel) and carried on, albeit to a lesser degree, trade with the regions west of the Aegean.

Until shortly after 1000 B.C., these three peoples—the old Trojans, the people who arrived in the first half of the 12th century B.C. and the Balkan people—lived together in Troy; thereafter, according to the archaeological evidence, the city was sparsely populated but not completely deserted for about 250 years...


P.S. Professor Eugene Borza:

"The theory of Dorian invasions is largely an invention of 19th century
historiography, and is otherwise unsupported by either archaeological
or linguistic evidence. Most archaeologists and many linguists have aba-
ndoned the belief that Greek speaking Dorians devastated Mycenaean
centers at the end of the Bronze Age..."
 

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