Албанците се населиле во Македонија во 1750 год.
- Креатор на темата bitushanec
- Време на започнување
- Статус
PIRRO
Walking away
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Изворот ти е копија на постот на THORN на balkanium.com ... Мисирков... барем од тебе очекував повеќе... Инаку баш би сакал да прочитам од споменатата книга ако можеш да постираш нешто... како доверлив извор... не копии на нечии постови.
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Ne znam koj e THORN, a za balkanium.com prv pat slusham. Da ne kopiral toj od mene? Ova pred nekoe vreme go postirav, a patem, izvadok e od eden moj esej.
Mislam imavme neshto od knigata na temata za "Potekloto za Albancite" - vidi tamu.
A toa za Manijak e standardno vo sekoj kurs po istorija.
Mislam imavme neshto od knigata na temata za "Potekloto za Albancite" - vidi tamu.
A toa za Manijak e standardno vo sekoj kurs po istorija.
PIRRO
Walking away
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ОК. Постот е ист... но сеедно... за темата... Прво спомнување на Албанците како народ...
Albanian emblem engraved in stone, 1190.
Anonymous:
Fragment on the Origins of Nations
What is possibly the earliest written reference to the Albanians is that to be found in an old Bulgarian text compiled around the beginning of the eleventh century. It was discovered in a Serbian manuscript dated 1628 and was first published in 1934 by Radoslav Grujic. This fragment of a legend from the time of Tsar Samuel endeavours, in a catechismal 'question and answer' form, to explain the origins of peoples and languages. It divides the world into seventy-two languages and three religious categories: Orthodox, half-believers (i.e. non-Orthodox Christians) and non-believers. Though the Serbs go unmentioned, the Albanians, still a small conglomeration of nomadic mountain tribes at this time, find their place among the nations of half-believers. If we accept the dating of Grujic, which is based primarily upon the contents of the text as a whole, this would be the earliest written document referring to the Albanians as a people or language group.
It can be seen that there are various languages on earth. Of them, there are five Orthodox languages: Bulgarian, Greek, Syrian, Iberian (Georgian) and Russian. Three of these have Orthodox alphabets: Greek, Bulgarian and Iberian. There are twelve languages of half-believers: Alamanians, Franks, Magyars (Hungarians), Indians, Jacobites, Armenians, Saxons, Lechs (Poles), Arbanasi (Albanians), Croatians, Hizi, Germans.
[Extract from: Radoslav Grujic: Legenda iz vremena Cara Samuila o poreklu naroda. in: Glasnik skopskog naucnog drustva, Skopje, 13 (1934), p. 198 200. Translated from the Old Church Slavonic by Robert Elsie. First published in R. Elsie: Early Albania, a Reader of Historical Texts, 11th - 17th Centuries, Wiesbaden 2003, p. 3.]
PIRRO
Walking away
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Каде прочита се доведени... било во текстот на Челеби било во текстот на Аталиатес ?... Еве го текстот од Аталиатес... ајде провери уште еднаш доведени,мигрирани,доселени, платеници... Освен тоа , што не се спомнуваат срби и македонци ??? 1038, 1042, 1078
Michael Attaleiates:
The First Byzantine References
Michael Attaleiates was a Byzantine lawyer and historian who rose to high office under the emperors Romanus IV (r. 1067-1071) and Michael VII (r. 1071-1078). His 'History', covering the years 1034-1079, is a largely eyewitnessed account of political and military events in the Byzantine Empire. It was during this period that the Byzantine Greeks first took note of the Albanians as a people.
When the Emperor Michael (1), who passed away in piety and whose home is known to have been the province of Paphlagonia, took up the sceptre of the Byzantine Empire, the Agarene (2) people in Sicily in the West were defeated by Byzantine naval and land forces.
And had not the well-known George Maniakes, who had been entrusted with the general command, been eliminated on the slanderous accusation that he was hungry for power, and had not the military command of the war been transferred to others, that large and renowned island, blessed with large cities knowing no lack of precious goods, would still be under Byzantine control. Now, however, jealousy has destroyed not only the man and his endeavours, but also that enormous undertaking (3). For when subsequent commanders made base and shameful plans and decisions, not only was the island lost to Byzantium, but also the greater part of the army. Unfortunately, the people who had once been our allies and who possessed the same rights as citizens and the same religion, i.e. the Albanians and the Latins, who live in the Italian regions of our Empire beyond Western Rome, quite suddenly became enemies when Michael Dokenianos insanely directed his command against their leaders...
Constantine IX Monomachos (4) proved to be more benevolent on the imperial throne than his predecessor. He conveyed imperial honours and gifts to almost everyone with ambition, and delighted his subjects. Suddenly storm clouds gathered in the West and threatened him with nothing less than destruction and expulsion from the throne. The aforementioned George with the surname Maniakes, thirsting for blood, began an uprising in the Italian part of the Empire with Byzantine and Albanian soldiers there, being offended because the emperor had shown him a lack of respect and fearing the emperor in view of previous hostilities. He caused great turmoil in the rest of the army opposing him and took it over. After having set up his camp at a two days' march from Thessalonika, he made his attack on the imperial camp in the evening...
When this had taken place and the usurpers had gradually calmed down, another disaster began to take its course and to spread like a poisonous weed intent on destroying the crops. The danger came from the city of Epidamnus (Durrës). The Protoprohedros Duke Basiliakes, who had been sent there by the emperor, having succeeded in avoiding Bryennius and withdrawing from Adrianopole, took over Durrës and assembled an army there from all the surrounding regions. By soliciting support for his side by means of substantial gifts, he succeeded in having the Franks enter his territory from Italy and attempted to make use of them for his side. By various pretences and means, he collected money from everyone under his order and command, set up a list and used as a pretext for this arms buildup the fact that he intended to attack Bryennius as a renegade. Once he had ensured that he had indeed assembled a large army and forces fit for action, composed of Byzantine Greeks, Bulgarians and Albanians and of his own soldiers, he set off and hastened to Thessalonika...
(1) Michael IV (r. 1034-1041).
(2) i.e. the Arabs.
(3) i.e. the recapture of Sicily in 1038-1040.
(4) Constantine IX (r. 1042-1055).
[Extracts from: Michaelis Attaliotae: Historia, Bonn 1853, p. 8, 18, 297. Translated by Robert Elsie. First published in R. Elsie: Early Albania, a Reader of Historical Texts, 11th - 17th Centuries, Wiesbaden 2003, p. 4-5.]
А ако го истражуваш потеклото на албанците од курејши народот (ова според Евлија Челеби) знаеш каде ќе стасаш ?...
Abraham was the prophet after Noah (and Noah was after Adam) to have been inspired by the word of God. He had two sons Isaac and Ishmael. Isaac is the father of the Jews and Ishmael is the father of the Quraishi Arabs. It is believed that the word Arab comes from Yereb, who was one of the descendants of Qahtan, the originator of the 2nd type of Arabs: Arab-ul-Ariba.
Значи Адам па Ноа па Абрахам па Isaac и Ishmael (не знам како ги именувате на словенски)... Евреите потоци на Isaac а Курејшите потомци на Ishmael ... Албанците се род на курејшите... Древна историја е тоа Мисирков , не знаеме ни 5% ...
1038, 1042, 1078
Michael Attaleiates:
The First Byzantine References
Michael Attaleiates was a Byzantine lawyer and historian who rose to high office under the emperors Romanus IV (r. 1067-1071) and Michael VII (r. 1071-1078). His 'History', covering the years 1034-1079, is a largely eyewitnessed account of political and military events in the Byzantine Empire. It was during this period that the Byzantine Greeks first took note of the Albanians as a people.
When the Emperor Michael (1), who passed away in piety and whose home is known to have been the province of Paphlagonia, took up the sceptre of the Byzantine Empire, the Agarene (2) people in Sicily in the West were defeated by Byzantine naval and land forces.
And had not the well-known George Maniakes, who had been entrusted with the general command, been eliminated on the slanderous accusation that he was hungry for power, and had not the military command of the war been transferred to others, that large and renowned island, blessed with large cities knowing no lack of precious goods, would still be under Byzantine control. Now, however, jealousy has destroyed not only the man and his endeavours, but also that enormous undertaking (3). For when subsequent commanders made base and shameful plans and decisions, not only was the island lost to Byzantium, but also the greater part of the army. Unfortunately, the people who had once been our allies and who possessed the same rights as citizens and the same religion, i.e. the Albanians and the Latins, who live in the Italian regions of our Empire beyond Western Rome, quite suddenly became enemies when Michael Dokenianos insanely directed his command against their leaders...
Constantine IX Monomachos (4) proved to be more benevolent on the imperial throne than his predecessor. He conveyed imperial honours and gifts to almost everyone with ambition, and delighted his subjects. Suddenly storm clouds gathered in the West and threatened him with nothing less than destruction and expulsion from the throne. The aforementioned George with the surname Maniakes, thirsting for blood, began an uprising in the Italian part of the Empire with Byzantine and Albanian soldiers there, being offended because the emperor had shown him a lack of respect and fearing the emperor in view of previous hostilities. He caused great turmoil in the rest of the army opposing him and took it over. After having set up his camp at a two days' march from Thessalonika, he made his attack on the imperial camp in the evening...
When this had taken place and the usurpers had gradually calmed down, another disaster began to take its course and to spread like a poisonous weed intent on destroying the crops. The danger came from the city of Epidamnus (Durrлs). The Protoprohedros Duke Basiliakes, who had been sent there by the emperor, having succeeded in avoiding Bryennius and withdrawing from Adrianopole, took over Durrлs and assembled an army there from all the surrounding regions. By soliciting support for his side by means of substantial gifts, he succeeded in having the Franks enter his territory from Italy and attempted to make use of them for his side. By various pretences and means, he collected money from everyone under his order and command, set up a list and used as a pretext for this arms buildup the fact that he intended to attack Bryennius as a renegade. Once he had ensured that he had indeed assembled a large army and forces fit for action, composed of Byzantine Greeks, Bulgarians and Albanians and of his own soldiers, he set off and hastened to Thessalonika...
(1) Michael IV (r. 1034-1041).
(2) i.e. the Arabs.
(3) i.e. the recapture of Sicily in 1038-1040.
(4) Constantine IX (r. 1042-1055).
[Extracts from: Michaelis Attaliotae: Historia, Bonn 1853, p. 8, 18, 297. Translated by Robert Elsie. First published in R. Elsie: Early Albania, a Reader of Historical Texts, 11th - 17th Centuries, Wiesbaden 2003, p. 4-5.]
А ако го истражуваш потеклото на албанците од курејши народот (ова според Евлија Челеби) знаеш каде ќе стасаш ?...
Abraham was the prophet after Noah (and Noah was after Adam) to have been inspired by the word of God. He had two sons Isaac and Ishmael. Isaac is the father of the Jews and Ishmael is the father of the Quraishi Arabs. It is believed that the word Arab comes from Yereb, who was one of the descendants of Qahtan, the originator of the 2nd type of Arabs: Arab-ul-Ariba.
Значи Адам па Ноа па Абрахам па Isaac и Ishmael (не знам како ги именувате на словенски)... Евреите потоци на Isaac а Курејшите потомци на Ishmael ... Албанците се род на курејшите... Древна историја е тоа Мисирков , не знаеме ни 5% ...
Ej brat, aj dosta im e...Gi faka i panika do ponedelnik, zosto znaat deka imete e veke smeneto....Site sosedi ne gi priznavaat, a losite Albanci ne ja vikaat Republika Makedonija, tuku Makedonija i Makedonci...a bogami go ne go zasluzuvaat toa....Amerika ne si ja jade g**** so ja s***.
A za Kafkaz, nemaat nisto fakti...Samo cekam da gi vidam makedonskive naucnici da idat vo Kafkaz, pa da vidam so kakva faca ke se vratat...
Vidi ja nivnata logika:
SKenderbeg, e Regnum Albania, Epir Makedonija i Trachibus i Albanija togas bila Makedonska. Vie ste Albanci, a ne albanci.....
Togas spored ova znaci nie ne sme od Kafkaz, ili Skenderbeg dosol od Kafkaz pa ja narekol zemjata Albanija...
Decka za smeenje ste...Ke se smeni ova, vi garantiram
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Браво, Римз, оној Мехмети сигурно има живи сведоци од 6 век пр.н.е. Браво! Така се пишува историја, без да читаш ... :bravo: :cheeky1::smeshko::smeshko::smeshko:
Мехмети не е историчар. Мехмети само го прашал Ресули. Вториов немал како да му одговори. Изгледа ти не ја сфати иронијата.
Точно така. Џабе е.
ahhaha, pa ako sme od toj del, od Kurejsite, Muhammed a.s, od Ismail, sinot na Avram, togas nie sme svet narod be......Lol Aj dosta so tresenje gluposti
Sturmgewehr
gadget
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си заборавил да напишеш Футнота доле кој го напишал ова како на пример вака
од СЛОБОДАН МИЛОШЕВИЧ, или КАПЛАН МРСУЛИ
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Браво Ајакс, секоја чест за твојот запис!
Докторот
DOMINUS
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Ти одговорив, ама ете уште еднаш, ако сакаш.....
За тоските не знам многу, ама веројатно помасовно се доселуваат во 15-16 век, додека гегите се првпат донесени 17 век.
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Kako gi objasnuvash togash istoriskite zapisi na postoenjeto na albancite na prostorov pred 15ti vek?
Dali sakash albanski ili stranski zapisi? Citaj pogore Misirkov sho ti pronashol od 10ti vek duri...
Sho prajme sea...kje go prepravish odgovorot, ili kje padne vo voda teorijata na doagjanjeto na albancite od kavkazot?
A
anaveno
Гостин
hahaha, ti si najprototipniot primer za nepovrzanosta na Makedonstinata so Antikata.....
A
anaveno
Гостин
doneseni se..ama koi?..
toskite?...
gegive se so romski,turski i arapsko-africki geni...
a doneseni se od Turcite...
nema nikakvi GEGI pred 18 vek...
spored jazikot,koj denes go govorat,a toa e jazikot na toskite,i slicnosta so KAVKAZ,doneseni od Manijakot se toskite ..
inaku,deka se lazni iliri,moze da se zakluci od pisuvanoto od 1308 g.
"Anonimen opis na istocna Evropa"...
karakteristikata za "albancite" e unikatna po karakter...
nemaat gradovi,zamoci,tvrdini,kreposti ili sela,
ziveat vo kolibi i postojano se dvizat od mesto do mesto,so svoite druzini i rodovi.
takvo nesto e nepoznato za site anticki narodi,megutoa,za onie od KAVKAZ natamu,poznati kako GEGI,katadnevie...
deka bile kopneno AZISKI nomadi,imame svedostvo do denes...
nemaat etimologija za pomorskite poimi i za zemjodelskite poimi...
kako vprocem i za ovostarstvo, gradinarstvo, medarstvo, pokuknina, obuvki, obleka...
inaku,arbanasite (onie od prvicnite izvestai),se pod znak prasanje (koi bile),bidejki tie se razlikuvale od toskite...
laznite iliri ja izmislija tezata,deka na prostorot na Komani-Kruja kulturata,od 7-9 vek,koja e cisto hristijanska i nema nikakvi dopirni tocki so nekakvi si GEGI,se zacetocite na albanskoto drn..drn...
zaboravaat deka arbanasite se spomnuvaat duri po 2 veka,a koi bile vistinskite arbanasi (?) e nesto drugo ....
neznam cie e toa Shipyaki....
- Статус