Македонија во VI, VII и VIII век. Војните при доселувањето на Словените?

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The Making of the Slavs - Florin Curta

Cambridge University Press
0521802024 - The Making of the Slavs: History and Archaeology of the Lower Danube
Region, c. 500-700
Florin Curta

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INTRODUCTION

Mein Freund, das ist Asien! Es sollte mich wundern, es sollte mich hц ch- lichst wundern, wenn da nicht Wendisch-Slawisch-Sarmatisches im Spiele gewesen wд re.
(Thomas Mann, Der Zauberberg)

To many, Eastern Europe is nearly synonymous with Slavic Europe.
The equation is certainly not new.

To Hegel, the “East of Europe” was the house of the “great Sclavonic nation,” a body of peoples which “has not appeared as an independent element in the series of phases that Reason has assumed in the World”.1

If necessary, Europe may be divided into western and eastern zones along a number of lines, according to numerous criteria.
Historians, however, often work with more than one set of criteria.

The debate about the nature of Eastern Europe sprang up in Western historiography in the days of the Cold War, but despite Oskar Halecki’s efforts explicitly to address the question of a specific chronology and history of Eastern Europe, many preferred to write the history of Slavic
Europe, rather than that of Eastern Europe.2

Today, scholarly interest in Eastern Europe focuses especially on the nineteenth and twen- tieth centuries, the period of nationalism.
The medieval history of the area is given comparatively less attention, which often amounts to slightly more than total neglect.
For most students in medieval studies, Eastern Europe is marginal and East European topics simply exotica.
One reason for this historiographical reticence may be the uneasiness to treat the medieval history of the Slavs as (Western) European history.

Like Settembrini, the Italian humanist of Thomas Mann’s Magic Mountain, many still point to the ambiguity of those Slavs, whom the eighteenth- century philosophes already viewed as “Oriental” barbarians.3

When Slavs come up in works on the medieval history of Europe, they are usually the marginalized, the victims, or the stubborn pagans.
In a recent and brilliant book on the “making of Europe,” the Slavs, like the Irish, appear only as the object of conquest and colonization, which shaped medieval Europe.

Like many others in more recent times, the episodic role of the Slavs in the history of Europe is restricted to that of victims of the “occid- entation,” the shift towards the ways and norms of Romano-Germanic civilization.4
The conceptual division of Europe leaves the Slavs out of the main “core” of European history, though not too far from its advancing frontiers of “progress” and “civilization.”

Who were those enigmatic Slavs?

What made them so diffcult to represent by the traditional means of Western historiography? If Europe itself was “made” by its conquerors and settlers, who made the Slavs? What were the historical conditions in which this ethnic name was first used and for what purpose?
How was a Slavic ethnicity formed and under what circumstances did the Slavs come into being?

Above all, this book aims to answer some of these questions.

What binds together its many individual arguments is an attempt to explore the nature and construction of the Slavic ethnic identity in the light of the current anthropolog- ical research on ethnicity.

Two kinds of sources are considered for this approach: written and archaeological.

This book is in fact a combined product of archaeological experience, mostly gained during field work in Romania, Moldova, Hungary, and Germany, and work with written sources, particularly with those in Greek.

I have conducted exhaustive research on most of the topics surveyed in those chapters which deal with the archaeological evidence.
Field work in Sighiёsoara (1986-91) and Tв rgёsor (1986-88) greatly contributed to the stance taken in this book.
A study on the Romanian archaeological literature on the subject and two studies of “Slavic” bow fibulae were published separately.5
A third line of research grew out of a project developed for the American Numismatic Society Summer Seminar in New York (1995).6
With this variety of sources, I was able to observe the history of the area during the sixth and seventh centuries from a diversity of viewpoints.

Defining this area proved, however, more difficult. Instead of the traditional approach, that of opposing the barbarian Slavs to the civilization of the early Byzantine Empire, I preferred to look at the Danube limes as a complex interface.
Understanding transformation on the Danube frontier required under- standing of almost everything happening both north and south of that frontier.

Geographically, the scope of inquiry is limited to the area comprised between the Carpathian basin, to the west, and the Middle
Dnieper region, to the east.

To the south, the entire Balkan peninsula is taken into consideration in the discussion of the sixth-century Danube limes and of the Slavic migration.

The northern limit was the most difficult to establish, because of both the lack of written sources and a very complicated network of dissemination of “Slavic” brooch patterns, which required familiarity with the archaeological material of sixth- and seventh-century cemeteries in Mazuria.

The lens of my research, however, was set both south and east of the Carpathian mountains, in the Lower Danube region, an area now divided between Romania, Moldova, and Ukraine.

My intention with this book is to fashion a plausible synthesis out of quite heterogeneous materials.
Its conclusion is in sharp contradiction with most other works on this topic and may appear therefore as argu- mentative, if not outright revisionist.

Instead of a great flood of Slavs coming out of the Pripet marshes, I envisage a form of group identity, which could arguably be called ethnicity and emerged in response to Justinian’s implementation of a building project on the Danube frontier and in the Balkans.
The Slavs, in other words, did not come from the north, but became Slavs only in contact with the Roman frontier.
Contemporary sources mentioning Sclavenes and Antes, probably in an attempt to make sense of the process of group identification taking place north of the Danube limes, stressed the role of “kings” and chiefs, which may have played an important role in this process.
The first chapter presents the Forschungsstand.

The historiography of the subject is vast and its survey shows why and how a particular approach to the history of the early Slavs was favored by linguistically minded his- torians and archaeologists.

This chapter also explores the impact on the historical research of the “politics of culture,” in particular of those used for the construction of nations as “imagined communities.”

The historiography of the early Slavs is also the story of how the academic discourse used the past to shape the national present.
The chapter is also intended to familiarize the reader with the anthropological model of ethnicity. The relation between material culture and ethnicity is examined, with a particular emphasis on the notion of style.
 
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Chapters 2 and 3 deal with written sources.

Chapter 2 examines issues of chronology and origin of the data transmitted by these sources, while Chapter 3 focuses on the chronology of Slavic raids.

Chapter 4 considers the archaeological evidence pertaining to the sixth-century Danube limes as well as to its Balkan hinterland.
Special attention is paid to the implementation of Justinian’s building program and to its role in the sub- sequent history of the Balkans, particularly the withdrawal of the Roman armies in the seventh century.

A separate section of this chapter deals with the evidence of sixth- and seventh-century hoards of Byzantine coins in Eastern Europe, which were often used to map the migration of the Slavs.

A new interpretation is advanced, which is based on the exam- ination of the age-structure of hoards.
Chapter 5 presents the archaeological evidence pertaining to the presence of Gepids, Lombards, Avars, and Cutrigurs in the region north of the Danube river.

Special emphasis is laid on the role of specific artifacts, such as bow fibulae, in the construction of group identity and the signification of social differentiation.

The archaeological evidence examined in Chapter 6 refers, by contrast,to assemblages found in the region where sixth- and seventh-century sources locate the Sclavenes and the Antes.

Issues of dating and use of material culture for marking ethnic boundaries are stressed in this chapter.

The forms of political power present in the contemporary Slavic society and described by contemporary sources are discussed in Chapter
7. Various strands of evidence emphasized in individual chapters are then brought into a final conclusion in the last chapter.
As apparent from this brief presentation of the contents, there is more than one meaning associated with the word ‘Slav.’

Most often, it denotes two, arguably separate, groups mentioned in sixth-century sources, the Sclavenes and the Antes.

At the origin of the English ethnic name ‘Slav’ is an abbreviated form of ‘Sclavene,’ Latin Sclavus. When Slavs appear instead of Sclavenes and Antes, it is usually, but not always, in reference to the traditional historiographical interpretation, which tended to lump these two groups under one single denomination, on the often implicit assumption that the Slavs were the initial root from which sprung all Slavic-speaking nations of later times.

Single quotation marks are employed to set off a specific, technical, or, sometimes, specious use of ethnic names (e.g., Slavs, Sclavenes, or Antes) or of their derivatives, either by medieval authors or by modern scholars. Where necessary, the particular use of these names is followed by the original Greek or Latin.

With the exception of cases in which the common English spelling was preferred, the transliteration of personal and place names follows a mod- ified version of the Library of Congress system.

The geographical termi- nology, particularly in the case of archaeological sites, closely follows the language in use today in a given area.
Again, commonly accepted English equivalents are excepted from this rule.
For example, “Chernivtsi” and “Chiёsina˘u” are always favored over “Cerna˘uёti” or “Kishinew,” but “Kiev” and “Bucharest” are preferred to “Kyпv” and “Bucureёsti.”

Since most dates are from the medieval period, “ff” is not used unless neces-sary in context.

In cases where assigned dates are imprecise, as with the numismatic evidence examined in Chapter 4, they are given in the form
546/6 to indicate either one year or the other.

The statistical analyses presented in Chapters 4, 5, and 6 were produced using three different softwares.

For the simple “descriptive” statistics used in Chapter 7, I employed graphed tables written in Borland Paradox, version 7 for Windows 3.1.
More complex analyses, such as cluster, correspondence analysis, or seriation, were tested on a multivariate analysis package called MV-NUTSHELL, which was developed by Richard Wright, Emeritus Professor at the University of Sydney (Australia).

The actual scattergrams and histograms in this book were, however, produced using the Bonn Archaeological Statistics package (BASP), version . for Windows, written in Borland Object Pascal  for Windows by Irwin Scollar from the Unkelbach Valley Software Works in Remagen (Germany).

Although the final results were eventually not included in the book for various technical reasons, the study of pottery shape described
in Chapter 6 enormously benefited from estimations of vessel volume from profile illustrations using the Senior-Birnie Pot Volume Program developed by Louise M. Senior and Dunbar P. Birnie from the University of Arizona, Tucson.7


1 Hegel 1902:363
2 Halecki 1950. Slavic Europe: Dvornik 1949 and 1956. Eastern Europe as historiographical construct: Okey 1992.
3 Wolff 1994.
4 Bartlett 1993:295.
5 Curta 1994a and 1994b; Curta and Dupoi 1994–5.
6 Curta 1996.
7 Senior and Birnie 1995.

Chapter 1
SLAVIC ETHNICITY AND THE ETHNIE OF THE SLAVS: CONCEPTS AND APPROACHES

Our present knowledge of the origin of the Slavs is, to a large extent, a legacy of the nineteenth century. A scholarly endeavor inextricably linked with forging national identities, the study of the early Slavs remains a major, if not the most important, topic in East European historiography. Today, the history of the Slavs is written mainly by his- torians and archaeologists, but fifty or sixty years ago the authoritative discourse was that of scholars trained in comparative linguistics. The interaction between approaches originating in those different disciplines made the concept of (Slavic) ethnicity a very powerful tool for the “pol- itics of culture.” That there exists a relationship between nationalism, on one hand, and historiography and archaeology, on the other, is not a novel idea.1 What remains unclear, however, is the meaning given to (Slavic) ethnicity (although the word itself was rarely, if ever, used) by scholars engaged in the “politics of culture.” The overview of the recent literature on ethnicity and the role of material culture shows how far the historiographical discourse on the early Slavs was from contemporary research in anthropology and, in some cases, even archaeology.
 
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Slavic studies began as an almost exclusively linguistic and philological enterprise.

As early as 1833, Slavic languages were recognized as Indo- European.2 Herder’s concept of national character (Volksgeist), unalter- ably set in language during its early “root” period, made language the perfect instrument for exploring the history of the Slavs.3 Pavel Josef
Safбrik (1795– 1861) derived from Herder the inspiration and orienta- tion that would influence subsequent generations of scholars.
To Sˇafб rˇik, the “Slavic tribe” was part of the Indo-European family. As a conse- quence, the antiquity of the Slavs went beyond the time of their first mention by historical sources, for “all modern nations must have had ancestors in the ancient world.”4 The key element of his theory was the work of Jordanes, Getica. Jordanes had equated the Sclavenes and the Antes to the Venethi (or Venedi) also known from much earlier sources, such as Pliny the Elder, Tacitus, and Ptolemy.

On the basis of this equivalence, Sˇafб rˇik claimed the Venedi for the Slavic history. He incriminated Tacitus for having wrongly listed them among groups inhabiting Germania. The Venedi, Sˇafб rˇik argued, spoke Slavic, a language which Tacitus most obviously could not understand.5 The early Slavs were agriculturists and their migration was not a violent conquest by warriors, but a peaceful colonization by peasants. The Slavs succeeded in expand- ing all over Europe, because of their democratic way of life described by Procopius.6
Sˇafб rˇik bequeathed to posterity not only his vision of a Slavic history, but also a powerful methodology for exploring its Dark Ages: language.

It demanded that, in the absence of written sources, historians use lin- guistic data to reconstruct the earliest stages of Slavic history. Since language, according to Herder and his followers, was the defining factor in the formation of a particular culture type and world view, reconstructing Common Slavic (not attested in written documents before the mid- ninth century) on the basis of modern Slavic languages meant reconstructing the social and cultural life of the early Slavs, before the earliest documents written in their language. A Polish scholar, Tadeusz Wojciechowski (1839–1919), first used place names to write Slavic history.7
Using river names, A. L. Pogodin attempted to identify the Urheimat of the Slavs and put forward the influential suggestion that the appropriate homeland for the Slavs was Podolia and Volhynia, the two regions with the oldest river names of Slavic origin.8

A Polish botanist,J. Rostafinґski, pushed the linguistic evidence even further. He argued that the homeland of the Slavs was a region devoid of beech, larch, and yew, because in all Slavic languages the words for those trees were of foreign (i.e., Germanic) origin.
By contrast, all had an old Slavic word for hornbeam, which suggested that the Urheimat was within that tree’s zone.
On the basis of the modern distribution of those trees, Rostafinґski located the Urheimat in the marshes along the Pripet river, in Polesie.9 Jan Peisker (1851– 1933) took Rostafinґski’s theory to its extreme. To him, “the Slav was the son and the product of the marsh.”10

Despite heavy criticism, such theories were very popular and can still be found in recent accounts of the early history of the Slavs.11
The rise of the national archaeological schools shortly before and, to a greater extent, after World War II, added an enormous amount of information, but did not alter the main directions set for the discipline of Slavic studies by its nineteenth-century founders.
Lubor Niederle (1865–1944), who first introduced archaeological data into the scholarly discourse about the early Slavs, endorsed Rostafinґski’s theory.

His multi-volume work is significantly entitled The Antiquities of the Slavs, like that of Sˇafб rˇik.12

Niederle believed that climate and soil shape civilization. Since the natural conditions in the Slavic Urheimat in Polesie were unfavorable, the Slavs developed forms of social organization based on cooperation between large families (of a type known as zadruga), social equality, and
the democracy described by Procopius, which curtailed any attempts at centralization of economic or political power.13
This hostile environment forced the early Slavs to migrate, a historical phenomenon Niederle dated to the second and third century AD. The harsh climate of the Pripet marshes also forced the Slavs, whom Niederle viewed as enfants de la nature, into a poor level of civilization. Only the contact with the more advanced Roman civilization made it possible for the Slavs to give up their original culture entirely based on wood and to start producing their own pottery.14

Others took the archaeological evidence much further. Vykentyi V. Khvoika (1850–1914), a Ukrainian archaeologist of Czech origin, who had just “discovered” the Slavs behind the Neolithic Tripolye culture, was encouraged by Niederle’s theory to ascribe to them finds of the fourth- century cemetery at Chernyakhov (Ukraine), an idea of considerable influence on Slavic archaeology after World War II.15 A Russian archaeologist, A. A. Spicyn (1858–1931), assigned to the Antes mentioned by Jordanes the finds of silver and bronze in central and southern Ukraine.16

More than any other artifact category, however, pottery became the focus of all archaeological studies of the early Slavic culture. During the inter- war years, Czech archaeologists postulated the existence of an interme- diary stage between medieval and Roman pottery, a ceramic category Ivan Borkovskyґ (1897–1976) first called the “Prague type” on the basis of finds from several residential areas of the Czechoslovak capital. According to Borkovskyґ, the “Prague type” was a national, exclusively Slavic, pottery.17

After World War II, despite Borkovskyґ’s political agenda (or, perhaps, because of it), the idea that the “Prague type” signalized the presence of the Slavs was rapidly embraced by many archaeologists in Czechoslovakia, as well as elsewhere.18

Following Stalin’s policies of fostering a Soviet identity with a Russian cultural makeup, the Slavic ethnogenesis became the major, if not the only, research topic of Soviet archaeology and historiography, gradually turning into a symbol of national identity.19 As the Red Army was launching its massive offensive to the heart of the Third Reich, Soviet historians and archaeologists imagined an enormous Slavic homeland stretching from the Oka and the Volga rivers, to the east, to the Elbe and the Saale rivers to the west, and from the Aegean and Black Seas to the south to the Baltic Sea to the north.20 A professor of history at the University of Moscow, Boris Rybakov, first suggested that both Spicyn’s “Antian antiquities” and the remains excavated by Khvoika at Chernyakhov should be attributed to the Slavs, an idea enthusiastically embraced after the war by both Russian and Ukrainian archaeologists.21

The 1950s witnessed massive state investments in archaeology and many large-scale horizontal excavations of settlements and cemeteries were carried out by a younger generation of archaeologists. They shifted the emphasis from the Chernyakhov culture to the remains of sixth- and seventh-century settlements in Ukraine, particularly to pottery. Initially just a local variant of Borkovskyґ’s Prague type, this pottery became the ceramic archetype of all Slavic cultures.

The origins of the early Slavs thus moved from Czechoslovakia to Ukraine.22

The interpretation favored by Soviet scholars became the norm in all countries in Eastern Europe with Communist-dominated governments under Moscow’s….

© Cambridge University Press
www.cambridge.org
 
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цитат..
Преведи!!!

И малце како совет да ти дадам, пола од времево што го потроши за славите, да го потрошеше на Венети, ќе дознаеше многу повеќе...дека ова и јас како албанец го учев во времето на Југославија...а за жал и ден денеска истото, како да не постои македонска историја......
одговор..
ти глуп си или нозете ти смрдат?..
едно е да читаш..
друго е да разбереш..
оди на драпање мадиња форумот..
а ако толку си запнал за венетите..
еве ти од мене па читај..
http://my.opera.com/ancientmacedonia
http://my.opera.com/ancientmacedoniansscripts
http://my.opera.com/macedonianarcheology

Епа како да разберам кога не е на македонски? :) затоа ти викам преведи...а за драпање мадиња...се глеа кој драпа :) ама ако бе, пропагирај ти за славите, и за големите срби :) и после зашто никој не ве сака :) ти сам не се сакаш
 
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АЛОООООООООООООООООООООООООООООООО..

ТОПИКОТ ЗА ЗАБЕГАНИ НЕ Е ТУКА.

Jас што пропагирам?

Oди бре на драпање мадиња. Oчигледно дека ти се помешало нешто...прашањето е: КАДЕ?
 
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Не знам кој забегува? Темава воошто не е за словени, него за Македонија пред времето на Словените. Е ај врати се назад 2 страни и прочитај кој забегува сеа...и не туку мрчи и обидувај да ме учиш нешто што ни самиот не го знаеш, секоја втора реченица ти е драпаш мадиња...
 
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anaveno

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Jаc се извинувам на дотичниот RYMZ. Tемава да ти била со наслов: Македонија во VI, VII и VIII век. Војните при доселувањето на Словените?

A објаснувањето: Темава воошто не е за словени, него за Македонија пред времето на Словените. Е ај врати се назад 2 страни и прочитај кој забегува сеа...

Eве се враќам назад во VI, VII и VIII век и ги гледам Славсите кај цепаат од Трскарија (Карпатија) накај МК-ја. Cироти...после плавањето по Дунај, не можат да свирнат, а не војна да водат.

Bистинското прашање е: кој тогаш им ги "свиркал" жените и ќерките, во "позадина", разбира се.
 
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The Real Highlander напиша:
Kade mozham da najdam informacii za Gotskata vojna, koja traela 14 godini? Do koga egzistirala drzhavata Slavija i kade se prostirala?
Bidejkji te nema da se druzhish podolgo vreme, eve edna mnogu dobra kniga od vodechkiot istorichar za Gotite, Peter Heather, koj predava na Worchester College na Univerzitetot Oxford.

Knigata e naslovena "Padot na Rimslkata Imperija: Nova istorija na Rim i na Varvarite". Tuka sakam da dadam eden citat od prvoto poglavje "Rimjani", vo koj Profesor Heather upatuva na Makedonija i Grcja kako na dva razlichni poimi:

" As winner of its local qualifiers, Rome graduated to regional matches against Carthage, the other major power of the Western Mediterranean. The first of the so-called Punic wars laster lasted from 264 to 241 BC, and ended with the Romans turning Sicily into their first province. It took two fruther wars spanning from 218-202 and 149-146, or Carthaginian power finally to be crushed, but victory left Rome unchallenged in teh Western Mediterraneanm and added North Africa and Spain to its existing power base. At the same time, Roman power began to spread more widely. Macedonia was conquered in 167 BC and direct rule over Greece was established from the 140s. This presaged the assertin of Roman hegemony over all the rich hinterlands of the Eastern Mediterranean. ..."

(Peter Heather, "The Fall of the Roman Empire: New History of Rome and the Barbarians," Oxford University Press, 2007, pg. 8-9)





A eve i interesna kritika od In Mejson za knigata na Profesor Heder:

http://www3.sympatico.ca/ian.g.mason/Ward_Perkins.htm


.
 

Bratot

Стоик и Машкртник!
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Dobro se gleda spored teorijata za preselbata na Slovenite...na koi regioni se naselile..ama izgleda samo nie go imame primatot da bideme narekovani od cistokrvnite sosedi so ''sloveni''
 
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anaveno

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Kakto se kazva komentarot e izlishen.

Hикакви славјански племиња не се населиле тука, а уште помалку пак некои 7 анти.

Tатаро-монголот што го цитира Микулчич, подобро нека копа да најде траги од Антите, инаку...

Cега засега, татаро-монголството му е во големо водство, пра-блгари се Мостич и компанија.

Cите карти, на кои демек има славси, се фикција. Hикаде нема рална карта од времето на пливањето.
 
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anaveno

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Инaкy за мрсникот Микулчич не би трошел зборови. Hо, покрај сите небулози во неговата "БГ библија" го напишал и ова:

" Понатаму на север од спомнатите региони, а тоа значи и на подрачjето на денешна Република Македониjа, нема писмени докази за престоjот на Словени во тоа време. Исто така, нема ни археолошки наоди од тоа време и покраj тоа што во изминатите 4 децении со интензивни рекогносцирања на теренот евидентиравме околу 3.600 археолошки локалитети од различни епохи. [17] Ранословенски наоди нема..."

КОГА ЌЕ НАЈДАТ ДА МИ ЈАВАТ!!!

" Одговорот на ова загатка не лежи во непознаването на материjалната култура на Словените. Словенски гробови (со кремациjа, во урни) и остатоци од населби се откриени во Jужна и Средна Грциjа; колку се оди повеќе кон jуг, толку се тие поброjни."
............

" Имено, Исидор од Севиља забележал дека во 5-та година од владеењето на Ираклиj (614/15 г.) Словените целосно го окупирале просторот на Грциja. За да дојдат таму, тие морале попат да ja прегазат и Македониjа. За жал, досега не успеавме да регистрираме археолошки (материjални) траги од присуството на Словените на нашето подрачjе од 7., 8. и поголемиот дел од 9. век."


ОВОЈ НОРМАЛЕН ЛИ Е ?!? ......... и притоа БУГАРСКА ИКОНА.
 
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anaveno

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Aко археолозите не успеале да најдат траги од Славсите во 9 век. како тогаш Солуњаните и светите браќа Кирил и Методиј "чисто славјански зборувале" ???

Tоа значи народот на овие подрачја си зборувал на Македонски јазик!

Tоа "славски" и до ден денес не е разјазнето што означува.

Bеројатно кога ќе најдат нешто славско, ќе им се разјасни.
 
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Oд историјата на војните на Славсите, според Русите:


" Расселение славјан по Восточно-европејској равнине В ПВЛ содержитсја версија о заселении славјанами Восточно-европејској равнины. Когда волохи напали на славјан дунајских и поселились среди них, и притеснјали их, то славјане эти пришли (значи,одовде натаму)...

Этот отрывок (в самом начале в свјази с расселением славјан он приведён в полностьју) часто интерпретирујут как уход предков полјан, древлјан, дреговичеј и ильменских славјан с Карпат. В одних случајах (Б.А.Рыбаков) волохов отождествлјајут с римлјанами Тројана. В других (В.О.Клјучевскиј), с аварами. В обоих случајах прародиној восточных славјан считајут Карпаты, хотја Нестор нигде не упоминает гор как места, где жили славјане, нет гор и славјанском эпосе.

Волохи определённо некиј романизированныј народ, но никак не античные римлјане.

Третиј этап — от VI в. н.э. до первых веков II тысјачелетија н.э.

Это период расселенија славјан в Карпато-Дунајских (па каде живееле пред Карпатите??????) и Балкано-Дунајских землјах,..
По этому периоду, как будет показано ниже, в румынској археологическој науке шли и идут ожесточенные споры; выдвигајутсја различные, противоречаштие друг другу гипотезы, коренным образом менјајутсја взглјады и концепции, а с ними и этническаја атрибуција памјатников, обштее представление о восточнороманском этногенезе.

Начинаја с середины 60-х годов создајутсја новые концепции восточнороманского этногенеза, отрицајуштие вообште третиј этап, рассматривајуштие славјан лишь как пришлыј чуждыј элемент с крајне примитивној материальној культурој, оказавшеј лишь самое минимальное влијание на восточнороманскују народность, древних румын, этногенез которых протекал без сколько-нибудь значительного участија славјан...

Федоров Г.Б.
ЭТНОГЕНЕЗ ВОЛОХОВ, ПРЕДКОВ МОЛДАВАН, ПО ДАННЫМ АРХЕОЛОГИИ (ИСТОРИОГРАФИЧЕСКИј АСПЕКТ) "



Eте, и овие не си знаат етногенезата, пливале и пливаат во круг.
 
A

anaveno

Гостин
Украинците:

"Згадати про них вирішили українські і румунські учасники етнологічної експедиції. Від них і дізнавсја, што волохи — залишки доугорських пастуших романизованих племен Середнього Подунав’ја (Південно- Східна Європа). Їх відтіснили зі своїх земель кочовики-угорці. Досі живуть в Закарпатті на території Великоберезнјанського і Перечинського рајонів."


Преку Дунав ... ама натаму.
 
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14 јули 2007
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Anaveno, kuliraj.

Preselbata na Slovenite kaj narodot e vlezena vo engramite na mozokot, brisenje na engramite odi tesko.

Covekot koga dobiva zadaca da izvrsi slozeno dvizenje, vo prvo vreme se maci korteksot koj e odgovoren za slozeni dvizenja, no so tek na vreme dvizenjata stanuvaat avtomatski, avtomatiziranoto dvizenje se spusta na ponisko nivo na upotreba na mozokot, znaci se napravil engram/zapis koj kako softver go kontrolira hardverot = dvizenjeto. Pa taka bez da go upotrebuvame mozokot nie skokame, trcame, se kacuvame po skali ....

Aftomatiziranite dvizenja najtesko se menuvaat.

Predispozicija za brzo ucenje na slozeni koordinativni dvizenja imaat inteligentni luge. Se drugo e trosenje na vremeto.

Istoto se slucuva i so istorijata, taa e veke vlezena vo sistemot, nema prostor za upotreba na mozokot.

Ke citiram eden profesor "Svinjata ke se nervira, a ti ke si gubis vreme"
 

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